Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

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Casey Brier
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Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Casey Brier »

A few weeks ago in our CASOC section we were talking about changes that COULD be made. one that was brought up was the idea of going to a "Racing Season" and a “Winter Season". This idea was a big hit. Some people had different ideas of when it should start and stop, but almost everyone agreed that some sort of racing season should be implemented.

My proposal was to run A race season starting in March and ending in October. These races would be like our normal races and count towards year end points. one maybe two events are dropped. He who has the most points wins. (just like we do it now, only shorter by 3 months.)

Then in November December and January, we have a winter shootout series. This would also have a points battle, but much smaller. No drops, he with the most points wins the winter series trophy. (to make up for the cost of trophies, say only first place winners of each class get a trophy…. No second or third place trophies for the day during these months.)


:arrow: Here is my reasoning:
November with Thanksgiving is a pain for a lot of people along with a budget crisis looking at Christmas.

December is even more of a pain, and more so with money due to Christmas.

January is a nice break and a chance to let the race car fund grow a bit.

These 3 months would also be a great time for someone to do MAJOR upgrades to their car.




I am not trying to take money away from CSCC….. so how do I think this will help bring more money?

- well, for one I think this will not effect us die hards that show up no matter what anyways.

- I also think that its easier for your normal person to commit to 9 months of racing then it is for someone to commit 12 months of racing. I do think this will increase attendance for the 9 months.

- I also think that the winter series will make people want to commit for those 3 months as well. (yes I realize that this would still be committing to 12 months of racing). What I am getting at is that I am sure that many of the classes are nearly if not already locked up by October. It think it would give MANY people the feeling of “why even show up in November or December if I don’t stand a chance anyways”. I guess what I am getting at is after 9 months of racing, the points have become stale??? I would assume that this theory could be backed up by looking at this years points and maybe the last 2 or 3 years?





I personally don’t care too much since I attend almost every race anyways, but I do believe this will help bring CSCC more money. I think it will raise attendance and will keep things interesting throughout the entire year.


Just an idea. I wanted to see if anyone else thought it was a good idea? :?:




I shall call the 9 month points battle "THE BATTLE"

and the 3 month points shootout "THE SHOOTOUT"
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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Bill Schenker »

Great!!!
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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Randy Chase »

I think it has some merit, but I would suggest end "racing season" with Nationals. The "off season" would be any events from Nationals (or mid September) until early March (when we have a ProSolo and Tour). Or was that the point? lol
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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Casey Brier »

That would be a short Season. (6 months)

could always do Jan - Sept... thats still 9 months, and ends with Nationals.

then have Oct-Dec for winter series. :thumbup:
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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Aaron Goldsmith »

Casey Brier wrote:That would be a short Season. (6 months)

could always do Jan - Sept... thats still 9 months, and ends with Nationals.

then have Oct-Dec for winter series. :thumbup:
Going off the proposed schedule for next year from the minutes, that would give us 10-11 or so events in the regular season and 4-5 events in the offseason. With the season probably ending the first event after nationals since I doubt anyone would agree to have the last event of the year be NOTLD.

The 2009 Calendar was discussed and the following dates and venues are tentative.
Jan 10-11 Fontana
Jan 31-Feb 1 Fontana
Feb 28 CSCC Banquet
Feb 28-Mar 1 El Toro
Mar 20-22 El Toro (ProSolo)
Apr 4-5 El Toro
May 2-3 Fontana
(alt date May 16-17)
May 30-31 Lonepine Event
June 13-14 Fontana
(alt date June 6-7)
June 19-21 FSAE
(alt date June 27-19)
July 18-19 El Toro
(alt date July 25-26)
Aug 8-NOTLD Fontana
Sept 26-27 Fontana
----------------------------
Oct 24-25 Fontana
Nov 21-22? TBD
Nov 27-29? TBD
Dec 12-13 TBD
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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Glenn Duensing »

Nothing new. It's been shot down several times before but who knows now as long as my name isn't mentioned :roll: The break was suggested when we put limits on the the entries because of daylight problems (Nov, Dec Jan).
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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Casey Brier »

Night of the living dead would be a great way to end a season. end it with a bang! :thumbup:

11 and 5 race seasons look just gravy to me. :)

Like I said, I'm easy. I'll be there no matter what. I just wouldnt want to make the championship season toooooo short.
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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Casey Brier »

yeah, thats what I heard. this is not the first time it has been thought of, and has been shot down more then once.

Seems odd to me since just about everyone seems to like the idea, its really a matter of when to start and when to end that seems to be te question.
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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Glenn Duensing »

With the Nov, Dec and Jan events held to entry caps, it makes sense to make that season break. Also as you mentioned, Thanksgiving, Christmas and New Years it's almost a no brainier.

Ending the season in Sept, well it's too early as some people take vacations during the summer. Also you need to look at how many drops you would have. With nine events, you would only have one drop. One could always added another drop or add a couple more events. SFR uses the two series mainly because of the rain. Usually 16-18 events regular and 3-5 winter. IMHO, 12 summer and 3-4 winter is perfect. :)
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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Robert Puertas »

Aaron, the Banquet is Feb 8th at the Toyota Museum.

Splitting the season seems to have a number of advantages and very few disadvantages...

Trophy expenses comes to mind as an issue, but I'd vote for doing away with individual event trophies and just doing better trophies for each of the two season championships. Getting a jacket in October is always better than getting it in February!
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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Bob Beamesderfer »

Aaron Goldsmith wrote: Going off the proposed schedule for next year from the minutes, that would give us 10-11 or so events in the regular season and 4-5 events in the offseason. With the season probably ending the first event after nationals since I doubt anyone would agree to have the last event of the year be NOTLD.

The 2009 Calendar was discussed and the following dates and venues are tentative.
Jan 10-11 Fontana
Jan 31-Feb 1 Fontana

Feb 28-Mar 1 El Toro

Apr 4-5 El Toro
May 2-3 Fontana (alt date May 16-17)

June 13-14 Fontana (alt date June 6-7)

July 18-19 El Toro (alt date July 25-26)
Aug 8-NOTLD Fontana
Sept 26-27 Fontana
----------------------------
Oct 24-25 Fontana
Nov 21-22? TBD
Nov 27-29? TBD
Dec 12-13 TBD
But if the season starts in March with the event just before Tour and ends with the event just after Nationals, there would 7 in the regular season and 6 in the "Slush Series." It could also be split 9/4 in order to make for a longer regular season, adding in the second event after Nationals. [deleted non-Regional Solo events from list for simplicity.]
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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Robert Puertas »

9 or 10 races with 2 drops for the main series, and 3 or 4 races with no drops for the winter series.

Ending the series with the NOTLD is a great idea.
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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by George Schilling »

Glenn Duensing wrote:With the Nov, Dec and Jan events held to entry caps, it makes sense to make that season break. Also as you mentioned, Thanksgiving, Christmas and New Years it's almost a no brainier.

Ending the season in Sept, well it's too early as some people take vacations during the summer. Also you need to look at how many drops you would have. With nine events, you would only have one drop. One could always added another drop or add a couple more events. SFR uses the two series mainly because of the rain. Usually 16-18 events regular and 3-5 winter. IMHO, 12 summer and 3-4 winter is perfect. :)
Way too many events Glenn. By the time you add in Nationals, the divisional, national tour and pro solo, there's no time left or anything else. We'll burn everyone out.

Robert's numbers seem more reasonable.
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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Will Kalman »

Randy Chase wrote:I think it has some merit, but I would suggest end "racing season" with Nationals.
I disagree. People will want to save their cars or strategize their tires, not risk compromising local competition or Nationals. Your idea makes both "series", if you will, happen simultaneously.

I think the local season should start right after Nationals and go to 3 months before Nationals the following year. Schools, practices, special events (like SCNAX Cup), and test-n-tunes can take up the time in-between, allowing newbies to get educated and nationals types to tune, if they want - or not.
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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Glenn Duensing »

George Schilling wrote:
Glenn Duensing wrote:With the Nov, Dec and Jan events held to entry caps, it makes sense to make that season break. Also as you mentioned, Thanksgiving, Christmas and New Years it's almost a no brainier.

Ending the season in Sept, well it's too early as some people take vacations during the summer. Also you need to look at how many drops you would have. With nine events, you would only have one drop. One could always added another drop or add a couple more events. SFR uses the two series mainly because of the rain. Usually 16-18 events regular and 3-5 winter. IMHO, 12 summer and 3-4 winter is perfect. :)
Way too many events Glenn. By the time you add in Nationals, the divisional, national tour and pro solo, there's no time left or anything else. We'll burn everyone out.

Robert's number seem more reasonable.
Not everybody goes the the big events like Tours, Pro and such.
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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Aaron Goldsmith »

Robert Puertas wrote:9 or 10 races with 2 drops for the main series, and 3 or 4 races with no drops for the winter series.

Ending the series with the NOTLD is a great idea.
Except for all the people who hate NOTLD and don't want it to be a points event at all.
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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Casey Brier »

Will Kalman wrote:
Randy Chase wrote:I think it has some merit, but I would suggest end "racing season" with Nationals.
I disagree. People will want to save their cars or strategize their tires, not risk compromising local competition or Nationals. Your idea makes both "series", if you will, happen simultaneously.

I think the local season should start right after Nationals and go to 3 months before Nationals the following year. Schools, practices, special events (like SCNAX Cup), and test-n-tunes can take up the time in-between, allowing newbies to get educated and nationals types to tune, if they want - or not.


understandable. the only problem is then you are starting in Sep or Oct, and running untill Juneish... kinda like school. makes the year a litle hard to describe.

I dont knwo, I guess its not all that bad. kinda like when you graduate high school. you go from 1998-1999, but its considered 1999.

:)

if we ran 2009-2010, it would be consdered the 2010 season.



...... hmmmmm.... not such a bad idea.

I sitll like my time line..... but I can see where your goin.

I smell what your steppin in. :thumbup:


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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Casey Brier »

Aaron Goldsmith wrote:
Robert Puertas wrote:9 or 10 races with 2 drops for the main series, and 3 or 4 races with no drops for the winter series.

Ending the series with the NOTLD is a great idea.
Except for all the people who hate NOTLD and don't want it to be a points event at all.


too bad. its part of the game. }:)
They can use that as one of their drops if they like. :twisted:
Last edited by Casey Brier on Tue Oct 28, 2008 3:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Aaron Goldsmith »

Glenn Duensing wrote: Not everybody goes the the big events like Tours, Pro and such.
And we should support the people in our region that put in the extra effort and do. Man, for a while earlier in the year there was NO none solo event weekends for weeks at a time, it was killing me and I was just trying to do the minimum events to go to nationals and still make the local events to stay alive for the local STU championship.

Trying to make a serious natioanls run you also need to do testing on non-local event weekends, usually involving trips down to San Diego.

Our region sends a very large number of people to nationals and given what I've seen in the last couple years puts on the best Pro-Solo in the country. We should be very proud of our Nationals level competitors and events.

That's saying nothing about the awesome divisional series this year that required you to drive to San Fransisco and San Diego for events. It was a great event.

I think that we should aim for about 1 a month, if you want more there is CERTAINLY more autocross out there to do, I can attest to that.
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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Aaron Goldsmith »

Casey Brier wrote: too bad. its part of the game. }:)
They can use that as one of their drops if they like.
Comments like that are just gunna get them riled up about having it removed as a points event again Casey. Me I don't care, I can see at night fine and I like red bull.

Almost all my drops ever have been used for idiots who schedule their weddings on race weekends. Jerks.
Last edited by Aaron Goldsmith on Tue Oct 28, 2008 3:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Robert Puertas »

Aaron Goldsmith wrote:
Robert Puertas wrote:9 or 10 races with 2 drops for the main series, and 3 or 4 races with no drops for the winter series.

Ending the series with the NOTLD is a great idea.
Except for all the people who hate NOTLD and don't want it to be a points event at all.
:lol:

Nobody hates that event more than I do.

Having been forced to drive first a shifter kart, then O'Blenes BP RX7 in the dark, due to the sheer stupidity of a couple of people, I have no intention of ever attending it again.
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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Casey Brier »

see and I disagree. (we are getting a little off topic here, but its all good)

I think the BIG races should be separated. not everyone can go down to San Diego or El Toro. not everyone wants to do a Pro Solo. (I love them). but the point is, those should NOT be a part of our local points series.

(hopefully I am understanding right, sorry if I miss interpreted)
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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Casey Brier »

Aaron Goldsmith wrote:
Casey Brier wrote: too bad. its part of the game. }:)
They can use that as one of their drops if they like.
Comments like that are just gunna get them riled up about having it removed as a points event again Casey. Me I don't care, I can see at night fine and I like red bull.

Almost all my drops ever have been used for idiots who schedule their weddings on race weekends. Jerks.

he he, sorry, it was not inteneded to get people mad.

I'm just sayin that the night race is to escape the heat. and I think its a great idea. it is also a nice change of pace.
I dont see why it cant be counted as a poitns race. but what ever. I am open to not having it count..... again. I am easy. :D
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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Aaron Goldsmith »

Will Kalman wrote:
Randy Chase wrote:I think it has some merit, but I would suggest end "racing season" with Nationals.
I disagree. People will want to save their cars or strategize their tires, not risk compromising local competition or Nationals. Your idea makes both "series", if you will, happen simultaneously.

I think the local season should start right after Nationals and go to 3 months before Nationals the following year. Schools, practices, special events (like SCNAX Cup), and test-n-tunes can take up the time in-between, allowing newbies to get educated and nationals types to tune, if they want - or not.
I kinda like this idea. Our problem in socal isn't the rain, it's heat. It also seems to be when we get a large influx of new people who would benefit for schools and such.

So: Sept-Oct Through May-June
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Re: Rules Proposal 2009-03 - Seasons

Post by Bob Beamesderfer »

Robert Puertas wrote:
Aaron Goldsmith wrote:
Robert Puertas wrote:9 or 10 races with 2 drops for the main series, and 3 or 4 races with no drops for the winter series.

Ending the series with the NOTLD is a great idea.
Except for all the people who hate NOTLD and don't want it to be a points event at all.
:lol:

Nobody hates that event more than I do.

Having been forced to drive first a shifter kart, then O'Blenes BP RX7 in the dark, due to the sheer stupidity of a couple of people, I have no intention of ever attending it again.
I'd probably rank as No. 2 on the list. I used to be able to go from pitch black in a darkroom to white lights without an issue, but that was 25 years ago. I don't find the event fun, so I've used a drop on it and don't care if it's points or not. However, I'd rather not have it as the season-ending event.
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