When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
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Re: When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
It's site dependent I guess but the factor used at nationals was .975
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Re: When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
not happening for 2013 for sure, probably not happening ever unless they just get rid of regular stock class all together.
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Re: When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
So how are the RT classes going to work?
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Re: When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
the same as they did this year?Mako Koiwai wrote:So how are the RT classes going to work?
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Re: When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
What are you referring to here? When I looked at Rick Ruth's PAX/RTP national results, he just used the regular stock class index numbers for the RT folks. Needless to say that ranked them way down.Bobby Beyer wrote:It's site dependent I guess but the factor used at nationals was .975
See here:
http://www.sccaforums.com/forums/forumi ... cope/posts" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Mako...your question is unclear as well. RT is already in place as a demo program. What are you asking?
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Re: When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
Bobby, when you say 0.975 was used "at Nationals", what do you mean by that? PAX isn't a part of Nationals competition. There is an exception this year for the RT classes, and that exception is within those classes, the Stock indexes are used. I'm guessing you saw someone's list of indexed times for everyone at Nationals, and that person chose to use 0.975. The SCCA doesn't publish or recognize an overall indexed time list. You could calculate one yourself, and use any index you wanted to for the RT classes.
Mako: How are they going to work locally for folks who want to run PAX class with an RT base class? That's up to CSCC to decide, and I'd guess we'll just continue however it was done this year. Rick Ruth, who is the sole person responsible for the PAX, hasn't been very friendly to the idea of creating an overall adjustment for street tires, and I don't really blame him (it would be hard to do and wildly inaccurate). There's probably not really enough data from this year to do separate indexes for RTR, RTF, and RTA: those were only run at the National Tours, and not all of those classes were well-subscribed at all of the Tours. I think Marshall is right. It won't really be worth Rick's time to generate indexes until those classes look like they will become permanent, and in their final form, and have enough participants that the statistics are vaguely meaningful.
Mako: How are they going to work locally for folks who want to run PAX class with an RT base class? That's up to CSCC to decide, and I'd guess we'll just continue however it was done this year. Rick Ruth, who is the sole person responsible for the PAX, hasn't been very friendly to the idea of creating an overall adjustment for street tires, and I don't really blame him (it would be hard to do and wildly inaccurate). There's probably not really enough data from this year to do separate indexes for RTR, RTF, and RTA: those were only run at the National Tours, and not all of those classes were well-subscribed at all of the Tours. I think Marshall is right. It won't really be worth Rick's time to generate indexes until those classes look like they will become permanent, and in their final form, and have enough participants that the statistics are vaguely meaningful.
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Re: When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
So it hasn't been decided yet how to level the RT classes we're running next year instead of SK1/2 ?That's up to CSCC to decide
Just trying to intelligently decide which car we might run in RT next year
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Re: When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
This is what I'm referring too...http://www.sccaforums.com/forums/forumi ... cope/posts I don't know if it was official or not but even with the PAX factor included none of the road tire guys broke the top 150 and even so it doesn't matter as you stated since the PAX factor is equal and doesn't affect the results from any other class.
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Re: When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
RT will be run just like SK1/SK2, except they will be split into RTF, RTA and RTR.Mako Koiwai wrote:So it hasn't been decided yet how to level the RT classes we're running next year instead of SK1/2 ?That's up to CSCC to decide
Just trying to intelligently decide which car we might run in RT next year
Within that, every car will run off it's own PAX factor, just like they do in SK1/SK2.
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Re: When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
RT classes are already in our computer because of the Super Regional. They currently have a street tire index of .980 just like the SK classes for use in overall PAX. If someone thinks that number should be different, now is the time to bring it up.
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Re: When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
So the PAX factor is set for our 2013 season ?Within that, every car will run off it's own PAX factor, just like they do in SK1/SK2.
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Re: When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
No, Rick Ruth sets the PAX factors. He will do the 2013 ones sometime in November I think.Mako Koiwai wrote:So the PAX factor is set for our 2013 season ?Within that, every car will run off it's own PAX factor, just like they do in SK1/SK2.
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Re: When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
My original question gets answered!
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Re: When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
Perhaps that's because your original question was a little...ummm... vagueMako Koiwai wrote:My original question gets answered!
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Re: When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
We will use the same modifier that was used for the SK classes.Mako Koiwai wrote:So it hasn't been decided yet how to level the RT classes we're running next year instead of SK1/2 ?That's up to CSCC to decide
Just trying to intelligently decide which car we might run in RT next year
kj
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Re: When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
Which modifier will be used at National events ?
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Re: When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
Ok - let's clear up some confusion here.Mako Koiwai wrote:Which modifier will be used at National events ?
The modifier is only used by us to figure out the overall PAX for the event. It is not used to determine finishing positions within SK/RT. Thus, it is not important.
This applies to National events as well. It is not used, except to calculate the overall PAX for the whole event.
What is important to you, a SK/RT competitor, is the class PAX, which is determined by Rick Ruth in November. That is what calculates your finishing position within your class.
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Re: When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
^^^ What Max says.
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Re: When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
It's close enough....Mike Simanyi wrote:^^^ What Max says.
We actually do use the .98 modifier to the base class PAX in the SK computations. Not that it makes any difference in the results. It just means we don't have to do a different calculation to compute the overall PAX results listing.
So, to be perfectly clear, for local events, your local PAX is the base class as determined by Rick Ruth, times 98%.
For national events, I have no idea if they use a street tire modifier. It doesn't matter unless you are looking to overall PAX performance.
kj
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Re: When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
Hmmm..this is SO confusing, maybe I'll just run ES. }:)
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Re: When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
Not worried about the ST modifier ... just wondering about how say a BS and CS RTR car are going to stack up against each other
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Re: When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
You can try and guess!Mako Koiwai wrote:Not worried about the ST modifier ... just wondering about how say a BS and CS RTR car are going to stack up against each other
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc ... cmc#gid=24" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Good luck with that though...
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Re: When do the PAX Index's come out for the RT Classes ?
Just compare SK1-BS and SK2-CS cars in any of our results. Of course rear drive cars only.Mako Koiwai wrote:Not worried about the ST modifier ... just wondering about how say a BS and CS RTR car are going to stack up against each other
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