Help with BMW weird trans behavior

Read at your own risk.

Moderator: Mike Simanyi

Post Reply
User avatar
Theo O.
Posts: 1277
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:29 am

Help with BMW weird trans behavior

Post by Theo O. »

Transmission in my race car works just fine during regular driving, even on road course like Willow or Auto Club, however I can never get it to go back into second gear after shifting into third during autocross ???? It just will not go back into second unless I bring the car back down to almost a stop. I left a ton of time out there yesterday because of this.

Any ideas?
"Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn." - Benjamin Franklin
User avatar
Jayson Woodruff
Posts: 1754
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:26 am
Club: PSCC
Car#: 51

Re: Help with BMW weird trans behavior

Post by Jayson Woodruff »

Bad Syncros. Commonly happens to 2nd gear because thats what we down shift into most (right turn at an intersection).

For now, try double clutching it.

Jay W
User avatar
Mako Koiwai
Posts: 6490
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:25 am
Club: SCNAX
Car#: 34
Location: South Pasadena, CA
Contact:

Re: Help with BMW weird trans behavior

Post by Mako Koiwai »

Switch to Redline MT90 ... a friction modified, ie. added, MT lube that allows syncros to work/work more easily. Transformed Karen's Miata tranny that we thought would need to be rebuilt ... made it possible to get into first without coming to a full stop in the Suby.

http://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=46&pcid=7
Last edited by Mako Koiwai on Tue Jul 26, 2011 2:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Mako Koiwai
Posts: 6490
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:25 am
Club: SCNAX
Car#: 34
Location: South Pasadena, CA
Contact:

Re: Help with BMW weird trans behavior

Post by Mako Koiwai »

A similar product is GM or Penzoil Syncromesh MT fluids: http://www.stealth316.com/2-pennzoil-synchromesh.htm
User avatar
Eric Clements
Solo Safety Steward
Posts: 895
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:25 am
Club: No$
Car#: 30
Location: Pasadena

Re: Help with BMW weird trans behavior

Post by Eric Clements »

Shift linkage binding? Are you shifting while the steering wheel is straight?
User avatar
Theo O.
Posts: 1277
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:29 am

Re: Help with BMW weird trans behavior

Post by Theo O. »

Eric Clements wrote:Shift linkage binding? Are you shifting while the steering wheel is straight?
Thanks Mako, I'll give one of those a try.

Eric, I believe this happens either straight or while turning. Is there a way for me to check the shift linkage?
"Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn." - Benjamin Franklin
User avatar
Eric Clements
Solo Safety Steward
Posts: 895
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:25 am
Club: No$
Car#: 30
Location: Pasadena

Re: Help with BMW weird trans behavior

Post by Eric Clements »

Theo O. wrote:Eric, I believe this happens either straight or while turning. Is there a way for me to check the shift linkage?
It's not so much the linkage being bad/worn as the engine/transmission twisting in the chassis.
User avatar
Mako Koiwai
Posts: 6490
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:25 am
Club: SCNAX
Car#: 34
Location: South Pasadena, CA
Contact:

Re: Help with BMW weird trans behavior

Post by Mako Koiwai »

So new mounts would be needed ?

How many miles on the tranny?
User avatar
Q V
Solo Safety Steward
Posts: 1398
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:26 am
Club: SCNAX
Car#: 69
Location: Orange County, CA

Re: Help with BMW weird trans behavior

Post by Q V »

Get an auto...





i kid, i kid! Good luck - try double-clutching first - if that works, you won't have to worry about shift linkage, correct? Then it's just a matter of synchros & fluids & $$$.

or get an auto... :twisted:
User avatar
Mike Simanyi
Former Club Chair
Posts: 2460
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:26 am
Club: No$
Car#: 6

Re: Help with BMW weird trans behavior

Post by Mike Simanyi »

I agree with the people saying to eliminate the twist, and I also think you should replace the fluid with Redline MT-90 (you need to buy two quarts.)

I recommend these motor mounts if you don't want to go with solid:
http://store.bimmerworld.com/bimmerworl ... -p930.aspx" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

And for transmission mounts (again, if you don't go solid on the motor mounts):
http://store.bimmerworld.com/rogue-engi ... -p406.aspx" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

And while you're in doing those things, you should probably also replace items 2 & 4 here (being sure to check for your actual model and production date at RealOEM):
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do ... g=25&fg=05" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

While you're under there, check the condition of item 1 here:
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do ... g=26&fg=10" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

That last item doesn't have anything to do with shifting, but it's a pretty common replacement item and if it lets go during a run, you definitely won't be setting your fast time...

Mike
Doug Rowse
Posts: 14
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:29 am

Re: Help with BMW weird trans behavior

Post by Doug Rowse »

Dumb question for you Theo...are you pulling the shifter too far over to the left? It's fairly easy when you're trying to snap a quick 3-2 downshift, while the car is turning to the right, to hang on to the shift lever a little and pull it past the detent all the way over to where reverse is. Unfortunately, it doesn't take too much additional pressure to get you well past the gate for 2nd gear. I've done this a couple times on Elliot's e36 since the detents on the e36 are very slight and wear over time.
User avatar
Theo O.
Posts: 1277
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:29 am

Re: Help with BMW weird trans behavior

Post by Theo O. »

Doug Rowse wrote:Dumb question for you Theo...are you pulling the shifter too far over to the left? It's fairly easy when you're trying to snap a quick 3-2 downshift, while the car is turning to the right, to hang on to the shift lever a little and pull it past the detent all the way over to where reverse is. Unfortunately, it doesn't take too much additional pressure to get you well past the gate for 2nd gear. I've done this a couple times on Elliot's e36 since the detents on the e36 are very slight and wear over time.
Doug, not a dumb question at all, you know I keep thinking about that too. I'm doing the next practice, hopefully someone can hop in my car for a lap and let me know if I'm really just that nuts.

Mike, thanks for the detailed list. I'm going to start checking those items off one by one. Definitely going to change the fluid like you and Mako suggested since I haven't done so in a while. I suck at preventive maintainance.

Can I get Redline MT-90 locally?
"Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn." - Benjamin Franklin
User avatar
Mako Koiwai
Posts: 6490
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:25 am
Club: SCNAX
Car#: 34
Location: South Pasadena, CA
Contact:

Re: Help with BMW weird trans behavior

Post by Mako Koiwai »

There are a couple of places in the Pasadena area that sell it ... you can do a Location Finder in the RedLine web site, and as I mentioned, GM and Pennzoil synchromesh is a similar product. You're basically looking for a Friction Modified Manual Transmission fluid ... of around 90 weight.

We have personally used the Redline MT-90 product in three of our vehicles to our great satisfaction
User avatar
Theo O.
Posts: 1277
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:29 am

Re: Help with BMW weird trans behavior

Post by Theo O. »

Mako to wrote:There are a couple of places in the Pasadena area that sell it ... you can do a Location Finder in the RedLine web site, and as I mentioned, GM and Pennzoil synchromesh is a similar product. You're basically looking for a Friction Modified Manual Transmission fluid ... of around 90 weight.

We have personally used the Redline MT-90 product in three of our vehicles to our great satisfaction
Mako, I went back up to you post and saw the link. I'm just going to order it online.

This is what I want right? 2 of them?

50304 MT-90 75W90 GL-4 - quart
"Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn." - Benjamin Franklin
User avatar
Mako Koiwai
Posts: 6490
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:25 am
Club: SCNAX
Car#: 34
Location: South Pasadena, CA
Contact:

Re: Help with BMW weird trans behavior

Post by Mako Koiwai »

Yes, but I don't know how much fluid your bmw needs
Giovanni Jaramillo
Posts: 2761
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:25 am
Club: PSCC

Re: Help with BMW weird trans behavior

Post by Giovanni Jaramillo »

Mako to wrote:Yes, but I don't know how much fluid your bmw needs
2qts maximum.
User avatar
John Fendel
Posts: 486
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:26 am
Club: CASOC
Car#: 23
Location: Lake Forest, CA

Re: Help with BMW weird trans behavior

Post by John Fendel »

Can I get Redline MT-90 locally?
Steve at Racing Lifestyles carries Red Line products. They are also listed on his web site. He may be at the next event at El Toro.
My sponsor, GRC in Mission Viejo, carries it and Steve at C2 Motorsports, who races with us, also carries it.
Please buy from those who race with and support us.
#ALSaware, GRC Performance, Red Line Oil
Doug Rowse
Posts: 14
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:29 am

Re: Help with BMW weird trans behavior

Post by Doug Rowse »

Theo O. wrote:
Doug Rowse wrote:Dumb question for you Theo...are you pulling the shifter too far over to the left? It's fairly easy when you're trying to snap a quick 3-2 downshift, while the car is turning to the right, to hang on to the shift lever a little and pull it past the detent all the way over to where reverse is. Unfortunately, it doesn't take too much additional pressure to get you well past the gate for 2nd gear. I've done this a couple times on Elliot's e36 since the detents on the e36 are very slight and wear over time.
Doug, not a dumb question at all, you know I keep thinking about that too. I'm doing the next practice, hopefully someone can hop in my car for a lap and let me know if I'm really just that nuts.

Mike, thanks for the detailed list. I'm going to start checking those items off one by one. Definitely going to change the fluid like you and Mako suggested since I haven't done so in a while. I suck at preventive maintainance.

Can I get Redline MT-90 locally?
I'd be happy to ride with you Theo and/or give your car a lap at the practice.
User avatar
Theo O.
Posts: 1277
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:29 am

Re: Help with BMW weird trans behavior

Post by Theo O. »

Thanks Doug.

I changed this transmission oil over the weekend. One more thing I now know how to do Image
"Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn." - Benjamin Franklin
User avatar
Mako Koiwai
Posts: 6490
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:25 am
Club: SCNAX
Car#: 34
Location: South Pasadena, CA
Contact:

Re: Help with BMW weird trans behavior

Post by Mako Koiwai »

And ?

The three times I went to a friction modified MT fluid like MT-90, it was immediately apparent and a noticeable improvement
User avatar
Theo O.
Posts: 1277
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:29 am

Re: Help with BMW weird trans behavior

Post by Theo O. »

Mako to wrote:And ?

The three times I went to a friction modified MT fluid like MT-90, it was immediately apparent and a noticeable improvement
It's like magic, not one missed shift up or down :thumbup:

Thanks for all the advice guys.
"Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn." - Benjamin Franklin
User avatar
Rick Brown
Current Solo Director
Posts: 5114
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:25 am
Club: PSCC
Car#: 240
Location: Lake Elsinore, CA

Re: Help with BMW weird trans behavior

Post by Rick Brown »

Theo O. wrote:
Mako to wrote:And ?

The three times I went to a friction modified MT fluid like MT-90, it was immediately apparent and a noticeable improvement
It's like magic, not one missed shift up or down :thumbup:

Thanks for all the advice guys.
And you won your class giving PSCC 100 points for the Pick-a-Team championship!
Since light is faster than sound...many people look bright until they speak...
Post Reply