Cal Club Autocross Forums

I've been wondering what would be the best from the factory cheap used car that would be worth buying if one was considering a DD & Racer?

I've been thinking alot lately about getting a 4 cylinder car to save on gas & all.
But of course this is sorta my excuse to feed my addiction to cars.

I'll admit its sorta stupid for me to even be thinking about this.
I live in a apt. & have to park my cars on the street.
between my girlfriend & I, we have 5 cars already.

CrewCab Dually
Mustang
Suzuki Samurai
Bronco
Saturn

Yes, My neighbors must hate me for taking up so much street parking.

I was thinking maybe something like a 914.

it would probably save me good money on fuel on those trips to vegas & stuff.

I originally wanted a Lotus Euroupa, but soon learned their not cheap.


I'd like an older car with some style preferably.

Older car, style, cheap, good for autocross from the factory [more or less], reasonable daily driver: 90-93 Miata, Honda CRX, '89 Civic Si.

OK, only one of those has any style and it's pretty much copied from the Lotus Elan.

Bob Beamesderfer wrote:...90-93 Miata...

Bob, I'm curious why you would limit it to just the 1.6?

Pat.

Pat O'Neal wrote:

Bob Beamesderfer wrote:...90-93 Miata...

Bob, I'm curious why you would limit it to just the 1.6?

Pat.

Cheapness, ability to run STS2.

what do miatas cost these days?

I was thinking in the $2000.00 price range.

Blanco .. wrote:what do miatas cost these days?

I was thinking in the $2000.00 price range.

You should be able to pickup an older one for about that much. STS2 is a street tire class; popular modifications are allowed, such as shocks, springs, swaybars, cat-back exhaust, intake, and others I don't remember.

I think the price on this one is a bit high, but it comes with a hardtop:

http://tinyurl.com/64gfeb

It's an independent dealer and they're obviously not too bright, the ad says it's FWD. If the soft top is in good shape, you could sell the hard top for about $800-$1,000 because of high demand from Spec Miata racers.

What other cars would you recomend?

& why no comments on the ones I mentioned above?

Blanco .. wrote:why no comments on the ones I mentioned above?

Because none of us drives them. Well, a couple do drive Mustangs...

Hey Blanca, check out the posting titled "1992 Miata for sale" in the For Sale/Wanted section. $400 for a running Miata *with* a trailer is cheap as hell. With the extra cash you saved, you could probably bring it close to "stock" configuration.

Blanco .. wrote:What other cars would you recomend?

& why no comments on the ones I mentioned above?

914s are now 35+ year old cars, and while fun to drive when they are running well, take a lot of work to keep running well. Finding a good one means that the price will be high.

The Europa only more so. Local legend Bill Martin has/had a Prepared class Europa that was apparently so delicate that it only ran two events per year..the warmup before Nationals and Nationals. He would run a Lola Formula Ford for the rest of the year (mostly). And you'll find that the SCCA fears old Loti, so much so that the only place they are usually raced is in the Mod classes.

Miatae, while slightly feminine in appearance, offer the most bang for the buck, are very reliable, and cheap to repair. As long as you are confident about your manhood, they are great.

Another choice might be the second-generation MR2, both NA and turbo versions (although unmolested turbos are hard to find). The best MR2 would be a '93 with ABS and PS, hardtop preferred. Good luck finding one so equipped, but even the T-top and sunroof cars are still competitive.

Kurt Rahn wrote:Hey Blanca, check out the posting titled "1992 Miata for sale" in the For Sale/Wanted section. $400 for a running Miata *with* a trailer is cheap as hell. With the extra cash you saved, you could probably bring it close to "stock" configuration.

Pssst, Kurt, it's Blanco. He might think your yanking his chain by misspelling it.

The 914 isn't going to be cheap to find in good shape and probably not cheap to maintain. The Europa even more so, although in its day it was something of an overdog.

The Miata in the For Sale section is a parts car. Rear end damage and the lack of parts doesn't make it worth messing with.

Forgot about the 2nd gen MR2. Good car, runs E Stock, not legal for STS2, but you could run the local street tire class that's based on Stock rules, SK2.

David Avard wrote:As long as you are confident about your manhood, they are great.

Guess this rules out "Schenker"

'89 Civic Si (Cheap or Unmolested, pick one)
'xx 90 Quattro ($700!)
Nissan Sentra SER
Volkswagen Rabbit (Potential for FSP)
BMW 318is
Audi Coupe Quattro
98 Subaru Impreza L (not that cheap)

Pssst, Kurt, it's Blanco.

D'oh! Sorry Blanco. Too hasty in my typing.

Mike, don't forget the Scirocco for FSP.

Having looked at a photo of the back of Mike Colangelo's $400 Miata, that damage isn't too bad. A good body shop might be able to straighten the section between the rear fenders. All the sheet metal in back is welded, so it's not as easy as dealing with front fenders. It would be a pain to make the car legal for Stock, less so for ST and SP. HVAC controls would need to be replaced.

94-97 Miatas can also run STS2, just not the ones with the limited slip.

I vote Miata, since I have one! Awesome daily driver and great fun to race.

Max Hayter wrote:94-97 Miatas can also run STS2, just not the ones with the limited slip.

I vote Miata, since I have one! Awesome daily driver and great fun to race.

Yes they can, but you need sort out whether it has one. Specific packages did and didn't and that varied for every year. Calling Mazda with a VIN is a waste of time. Anything installed at the port probably didn't get accurately updated.

I'm still looking for something different.....
what about a Mustang SVO?

Thats the mid '80 4 cyl turbo models.
They had a great rep....
But I dont know about them in AutoCross?

I've come to the conculsion that AutoCross is where its at & where anyone wanting to race stock learns what cars really perform!

F Stock cars, mustangs, camaro's etc. need big, ie. more expensive tires, if that's OK with you. And with their weight, you go through them faster. You can of course run those cars in our street tire classes.

The pony cars not only chew through more expensive tires faster, but they also wear out and/or break diffs often.

And with the pre-2000 pony cars you can run into some major tire availability issues. They just don't make too many 15-16 inch rim race tires that will fit on narrow stock rims. I don't think a 275-50-15 Hoosier will work on a 15x7 rim for example.

If I was coming in new to autocross and wanting a dedicated car I'd look at an STS2 Miata. Its very competitive and tough competition, but they are relatively cheap cars that are a blast to drive and the race budget is low.

The ES and HS can find some inexpensive older cars to run. Tire budgets are a lot higher though.

Bob Beamesderfer wrote:

Max Hayter wrote:94-97 Miatas can also run STS2, just not the ones with the limited slip.

I vote Miata, since I have one! Awesome daily driver and great fun to race.

Yes they can, but you need sort out whether it has one. Specific packages did and didn't and that varied for every year. Calling Mazda with a VIN is a waste of time. Anything installed at the port probably didn't get accurately updated.

Actually, the '94-'97s only came with a Torsen LSD (when they came with an LSD) rather than the available viscous LSD of the '90-'93 Miatas, and therefore aren't legal in STS2. But anyone building a Spec-Miata (road racers) has no use for the VLSD, so they are fairly cheap. Now, whether they still work is the question.

But just because a VLSD is available cheap doesn't automatically mean you can use it. The car had to have the VLSD as an option in order to add it. No update/backdate in ST, and no aftermarket diff allowances in STS/STS2.

I wish you could have seen Mary Pozzi thrash the Shelby GT through the course on Saturday (she had MANY Sunday issues). That would end all thought of trying to make an SVO or other 80's mustang competitive in stock class. The Shelby GT's are monster class killers in the right hands.

You cannot go wrong with any Miata.
The 1.6 is a good STS2 car.
The M1 1.8 is a good STS2 car without the LSD, or a good E-Stock car with it.
The newer carts are good C-Stock cars.
All are good CSP cars.
All have great potential in SM2, Prepared & even Modified.

That's the true beauty of the Miata, it can take you from bone stock to as fast as you can afford to go, and stay competetive across all the prep levels.

If you want something older and unique, consider one of the older sportscars for FSP. A Triumph TR6, MGB or Midget or a Porsche 912 would all be fun FSP projects

Some of our new members are BIG Guys. The one fellow, Kurt I think, said he just doesn't fit in a Miata ... but does fit in a Mini. Too bad ... he would Like RWD.