Porsche 993

[Elizabeth Bacon]

Hi folks!!

Hope y'all are doing fabulously. You're my best source of autox information so I'm hitting you up again. I'm considering a Porsche 993 (the 911 model from '95-'98) for SCCA autox competition. (I'll probably also check out PCA events with such a ride although I've never attended one before.)

All 993's (C2, C2S, C4 and C4S) are classed in AS. I've been doing my research, and based on looks & price-point I'd like to go for a Carerra 2 S (wide-body style) coupe. The Carrera 4 has more horsepower plus all-wheel drive. My questions are:

- Is the "S" wide-body style a liability for autox? Like, more challenging to get through slaloms?
- Is the 4 better than the 2 because of the extra HP and AWD?
- How does one transport a competition set of wheels & tires to events in a 911 without a trailer or extra car?

I've always wanted a Porsche and am excited that my dream may be within reach! All insights appreciated!!

Cheers,
Liz

[Jason Uyeda]

Yo... I'm not that familiar with the 993's but I thought they had a regular valve adjustment that's pricey. And I think there's potential issues with the timing chain that may not be legally fixable in stock??? I think ideally you'd want a M030 C2S like the Kozlak's are running. I'll fire you off an email with some contacts...

Why not a Boxster/Cayman? I know where there's a good 2003 M030 Boxster S

_J_

[Jason Isley BS RX8]

I would wait a few months to see if the CS-BS merger happens, and we get the Tweener class (AS 2.0). On the list of potential cars for the "new" AS is the 996 911. You should be able to find one for less than a 993, and it should have lower maintenance cost.

[Steve Towers]

Liz,

Come out to El Toro on Sunday, Oct 11 for the Porsche club autocross event. There will be quite a few very knowledgeable Porsche folks there. I'm sure they will be glad to help you out. If you'd like, I can introduce you around.

Steve Towers
Red Corvette #878

[Jason Uyeda]

Liz,

Come out to El Toro on Sunday, Oct 11 for the Porsche club autocross event. There will be quite a few very knowledgeable Porsche folks there. I'm sure they will be glad to help you out. If you'd like, I can introduce you around.

Steve Towers
Red Corvette #878

That would be a long drive for her from Portland...

Isley makes a really good point...

[Mike Simanyi]

Might be a bit too much of a commute for her to make that Steve.

Liz, that C2S is a beautiful car but they seem to be priced astronomically high. I was checking into them last year and most of the owners claim they're collectible, the last of the air-cooled engines, beautiful works of art, etc then throw a price out around $45k+... unless they're totally thrashed.

The 996 (?) (the one just after those, staring in '99 I believe) can be had for a song though. And as long as the work was performed to resolve whatever the problem was with that motor it should be pretty darn reliable. Jason's advice to hold off on the Stock reorganization is worth considering before you plunk down your hard-earned money.

I'd love to see you back in the game!

Mike

[Steve Towers]

That would be a long drive for her from Portland...

Oops........Didn't know/get the Portland aspect. I remembered Liz from the Pro at Norton, so I guess I'm a wee bit behind. ;)

[Jason Isley BS RX8]

Or... Pick up an 88-89 911 CS for STR. Should only set you back about $60k, if you can find one. :unimpressed:

[Mako Koiwai]

This Liz ? ... The Flirt ...

[Mako Koiwai]

Maybe get David Palmquist in on this discussion ...

[Steve Towers]

Maybe get David Palmquist in on this discussion ...

Or Rad Delgado, a very sharp Porche guy. I posted on the PCA-OCR website asking the for help on this issue.

Liz: you can go on http://www.pcaocr.org" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; and ask for help there.

[David Palmquist]

Did somebody call me????

Hello Liz!

As the owner of a 993, I might be a bit biased but can certainly give you a few tips along with the others. I think there are a few questions to answer to help determine where you are going with all of this.

1. Is an SCCA competitive car a primary or secondary consideration?
2. Do you want a 993 or do you want a "Porsche 911"?
If you are not sure, log on to Rennlist.org and check the 993 and 996 boards that are very active to gather info about each model. The 993 is very reliable and bulletproof. I bought mine with 90K miles and just hit 120K after 3 years and have done little to it besides oil changes and mild maintenance. Even in this soft market, they hold value well so a newer 996 with lower mileage can be had for less money - if you like them. While not really "collectible", there is a reason why the 993 holds it value. ;)

If you have settled on the 993 and want a reasonably competitive SCCA car, I would subjectively list them in this order from best to worst:
1. 1995 C2 - lightest of all of them
2. 1996+ C2 - Varioram intake improves midrange torque (good) but adds a lot of weight right where you don't want it.
3. 1995+ C4 - Still heavier but good for bad weather climates
4. C2S - Also heavier AND wider (1.5-2.0 inches) without improved HP or braking/turning performance
5. C4S - Same as C2S but with more weight!

I don't autocross mine, but I do participate in PCA autocrosses on a monthly basis and find that it is a good alternative to SCCA Solo2. In general, the competition is not at the same high level as Solo2 but the events are great fun and the single-marque allows for fair classing of the models.

Feel free to give me a call if you have specific questions. 714 five four two 6346

Good Luck!
David

[Max Hayter]

I'd love to see you back on the game!

Mike

[Elizabeth Bacon]

You guys rock! [Here's where I resist inserting a flirty emoticon]

Wow, no idea that a BS-CS/AS reclassing was in the offing, Jason I...that definitely complicates matters. The (way more affordable & apparently super-competitive) other car I've been considering is still the RX-8 so sounds like I should hold off altogether for the winter. AAARGH, I am DYING for a new car and I am NOT a patient person! Maybe the C5 Vette is my ultimate ride after all....

Yes, a competitive ride is very important to me, David. (A year back in my Eclipse makes it painfully apparent that "just doing it for fun!" isn't really that fun....) So that's why I'm not really considering the Boxster S anymore, Jason U, although a super-well-outfitted one like yours is tempting.... And what chance does the Cayman have to be competitive?

A non-thrashed 993 C2 is running about 25-30k, Mike, at least on EBay, so that's not terribly dear. 45-60k is what you're looking at for the C4S. And truly it's the most gorgeous 911, collectible air-cooled whatall be damned.

Oh why, oh why are the SCCA classes so tightly scoped? Sure would be nice to have a wider range of classes in which various cars could be competitive! (Obviously it's a multi-factorial equation, but still....)

Anyone have ideas about the cartage of wheels to events in a 911?

Cheers,
Liz

[Mako Koiwai]

Used SS 5 Z-06 $22K ... just can't beat that value! :gpower:

But Annie B. sold her's after something like 26 days ... something about driving it in the rain, and something about the climate up there ...

[Mike Simanyi]

And something about her inability to tame her right foot...

[Mako Koiwai]

... and something about only being as good as your seat time ... and seat time/practice is whenever she's behind the wheel of her latest

[Jack Tsou]

Used SS 5 Z-06 $22K ... just can't beat that value! :gpower:

But Annie B. sold her's after something like 26 days ... something about driving it in the rain, and something about the climate up there ...

I wish I know that a month earlier...
I checked autotrader.... all C5 Z06 were all in the 26k++ range...

As for Porsche, 06 Cayman S are around low 30k?

[Mako Koiwai]

Add Penskes to the Z-06 and it magically gets cheaper ?!

[Jeff Ringer]

http://orangecounty.craigslist.org/cto/1383628739.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Mako Koiwai]

hahahaha ... nail em on the price! Who cares if it has a "not great for AX'ing" sun roof!

[Bob Pl]

Used SS 5 Z-06 $22K ... just can't beat that value! :gpower:

But Annie B. sold her's after something like 26 days ... something about driving it in the rain, and something about the climate up there ...

Going from a c5z to an older (less developed tc/ah - traction control active handling) p car?

If WET HANDLING is important, I am not sure I follow this line of reason?

There must be more to it than this thread is telling.

I do have a liking for p car's, gonna get one some day.

[Marshall Grice]

Going from a c5z to an older (less developed tc/ah - traction control active handling) p car?

If WET HANDLING is important, I am not sure I follow this line of reason?

There must be more to it than this thread is telling.

I do have a liking for p car's, gonna get one some day.

she sold the vette and bought an STI.

[Bob Pl]

I think an awd car would be just the ticket in the Pacific NW if you travel the rainy side of the mountains.

[Mako Koiwai]

I thought she bought a WRX in between the Z06 and STI?