Henry I was wrong

George Schilling · Post by **George Schilling** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 6:47 am

The Honda S2K is a worthy daily driver. Sure the ride is bone jarring, and it's loud inside just like I said. But damit, it's fun. I've been driving it this week and I'm having a blast. I still prefer the mini as the daily ride, but I don't think you will regret buying an S2K.

Chuck Fowler · Post by **Chuck Fowler** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 12:15 pm

if your looking for something along those lines, the hard top convertible Miata is very nice. my wifes driving hers everywhere

same color

George Schilling · Post by **George Schilling** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 12:56 pm

Chuck Fowler wrote:if your looking for something along those lines, the hard top convertible Miata is very nice. my wifes driving hers everywhere

same color

A very nice choice indeed Chuck, in fact one that I suggested to Henry.

It's a much better daily driver from all aspects except one..................looks. Ya can't beat the S2K for looks. It has got to be on of the best looking mass produced cars of all time. Were it not for looks, I'd own a Corvette.

Bob Beamesderfer · Post by **Bob Beamesderfer** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 1:15 pm

The PRHT Miata is great, but I prefer the previous two generations' designs.

Henry Bjoin · Post by **Henry Bjoin** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 3:09 pm

George thanks for the comments. I was thinking about the review that you gave me on Sunday of the S2000 and realized that that's really the
type of car I prefer. I can put up with a little bone rattling and noise for a stylish car that's fun to drive. I was also looking at the hardtop Miata on Mazda website, it looks like a fun daily driver also, however I was surprised that the gas milage ratings weren't that good.

Mako Koiwai · Post by **Mako Koiwai** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 3:14 pm

The new Miata's are so softly sprung that they can't be rescued with stiff shocks. Leonard sold his. They have to go straight to CSP so you can get stiffer springs. I did a run with one on Saturday. The paddle shifters were fun to down shift going into corners but sometimes difficult to reach with the wheel cranked over. The car is so sloppy you have to input an incredible amount of time earlier then usual!

Bob Beamesderfer · Post by **Bob Beamesderfer** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 3:52 pm

Mako Koiwai wrote:The new Miata's are so softly sprung that they can't be rescued with stiff shocks. Leonard sold his. They have to go straight to CSP so you can get stiffer springs. I did a run with one on Saturday. The paddle shifters were fun to down shift going into corners but sometimes difficult to reach with the wheel cranked over. The car is so sloppy you have to input an incredible amount of time earlier then usual!

I'd check with Brian Goodwin first on this score. Besides, weren't we talking about a daily driver?

Bob Beamesderfer · Post by **Bob Beamesderfer** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 3:54 pm

Henry Bjoin wrote:George thanks for the comments. I was thinking about the review that you gave me on Sunday of the S2000 and realized that that's really the
type of car I prefer. I can put up with a little bone rattling and noise for a stylish car that's fun to drive. I was also looking at the hardtop Miata on Mazda website, it looks like a fun daily driver also, however I was surprised that the gas milage ratings weren't that good.

Henry, It's not an economy car and never has been. The tuning is for performance, although within what the factory thinks is workable vs. warranty and liability.

Mako Koiwai · Post by **Mako Koiwai** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 4:18 pm

Daily driver ... then 135 BMW !!!

A new M3 owner was telling me that the 135 felt "sportier" then his M3 because of it's lightness. He said for "normal" fast driving, the lack of a LSD is not a problem because the suspension is so "good." Former AX'er ... who also has a 550 (? twin turbo ?) BMW and Cayenne S.

Kurt Rahn · Post by **Kurt Rahn** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 6:21 pm

A new M3 owner was telling me that the 135 felt "sportier" then his M3 because of it's lightness.

Unfortunately, it only looks light since it's smaller than the 3 series, and probably felt sportier since the M3 is such a hog (3700+ lbs!). The 135 is actually 3300+ lbs, which is embarrassing for a car that size. That's the only knock I've found on it. For a daily driver, I'd be all over the 1, but it ain't an autocross car and it certainly doesn't channel the spirit of the 2002 as BMW would like everyone to think.

Giovanni Jaramillo · Post by **Giovanni Jaramillo** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 6:43 pm

Kurt Rahn wrote:
A new M3 owner was telling me that the 135 felt "sportier" then his M3 because of it's lightness.
Unfortunately, it only looks light since it's smaller than the 3 series, and probably felt sportier since the M3 is such a hog (3700+ lbs!). The 135 is actually 3300+ lbs, which is embarrassing for a car that size. That's the only knock I've found on it. For a daily driver, I'd be all over the 1, but it ain't an autocross car and it certainly doesn't channel the spirit of the 2002 as BMW would like everyone to think.

I was at a BMW dealership to get a part and there on the showroom floor is a convertible 135 in RED, with cold package, sport package, etc...etc.... Sticker price? $51k!!!

Are they INSANE?? We're talking about a 1 series BMW, stop the insanity!!

Chuck Fowler · Post by **Chuck Fowler** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 8:03 pm

since the wife won't (not can't, just wont

) drive a stick we got the 6 speed auto. i personally dis-like the paddle shifters. they have up AND down on both sides of the wheel. on the other hand, when you put it in "manual mode" you can also use the stick for nice up/down shifting that makes it feel like a sequential box. very sweet on a twisty road.
if you get the stick, you can get the Bilstien's, but i do like the stock ride for a DD. the car is very tossable

Kurt Rahn · Post by **Kurt Rahn** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 8:43 pm

Sticker price? $51k!!!

That would be the other complaint. They didn't make it attractive enough not to just get a bigger 335. sh#$, the car you saw is just $6K short of a base M3!

Mako Koiwai · Post by **Mako Koiwai** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 10:47 pm

How much for a base 135 ... can you even get them?

Steve Ekstrand · Post by **Steve Ekstrand** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 11:08 pm

In stock? Not a chance in hell of finding a base car.

But dealers can order for you.

How much of a dealer markup/addendum did that $51K car have. If you go off that, I'm driving a $58K dodge truck.

Kurt Rahn · Post by **Kurt Rahn** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 11:27 pm

If you go off that, I'm driving a $58K dodge truck.

I'm sure there was some dealer bloat. They can get away with it, though, cuz there's a relatively high demand since they're new. Retail base is $34K+, and with one or two "essential" option packages it goes north quickly.

Bob Beamesderfer · Post by **Bob Beamesderfer** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 9:08 am

Kurt Rahn wrote:
Sticker price? $51k!!!
That would be the other complaint. They didn't make it attractive enough not to just get a bigger 335. sh#$, the car you saw is just $6K short of a base M3!

You won't get an M3 for sticker, and if you optioned the 335 the same way it would be ridiculously priced.

The BMW X5 I reviewed last year started at $54k and the total with options was $76k.

$22k or a Mini's worth of options. It lacked maybe one or two things. Most carmakers put vehicles in the test fleet that they think represent what most buyers will want. The luxury German marques load the fleet cars to the gills.

Giovanni Jaramillo · Post by **Giovanni Jaramillo** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 5:32 pm

Steve Ekstrand wrote:How much of a dealer markup/addendum did that $51K car have.

Cold Package, Sports Package, Gas Guzzler Tax, and some other "mods" but no dealer markup. This was off of the sticker tag. Also it was a convertible.

Reijo Silvennoinen · Post by **Reijo Silvennoinen** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 5:53 pm

Getting back to the S2000. That is one of the things I liked about it. There were no options. It comes complete and the price is what it is.....no lack of those cars at the dealership. Correction: hardtop, floor mats, body dress-up pieces, and other little items like coffee travel mugs etc.....nothing that is solidly attached to the car. AC, leather sport seats and 6 speed manual (only tranny offered) are all std.. In essence, 20-30% of the cost of the car is not options.

Also, Henry, that's what I bought mine for - a daily driver. It's been a good car - not boring at all.

Reijo

Leonard Cachola · Post by **Leonard Cachola** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 6:44 pm

Bob Beamesderfer wrote:
Mako Koiwai wrote:The new Miata's are so softly sprung that they can't be rescued with stiff shocks. Leonard sold his. They have to go straight to CSP so you can get stiffer springs. I did a run with one on Saturday. The paddle shifters were fun to down shift going into corners but sometimes difficult to reach with the wheel cranked over. The car is so sloppy you have to input an incredible amount of time earlier then usual!
I'd check with Brian Goodwin first on this score. Besides, weren't we talking about a daily driver?

It's been long known that the NC just doesn't cut it for autocross in stock form - even Goodwin knows this, hence his highly modified IS2 NC. The only NC that does is the ultra-rare 2007 MS-R version (or one that's been converted). However, with that said, I feel that the retractable hard top version makes a fine daily driver - good ride, decent handling, and the fastest retractable hard top in production.

Steve Ekstrand · Post by **Steve Ekstrand** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 9:56 pm

Come on Henry.... You know you really want a Caliber SRT-4.

Has like three times the torque of an S2000.

Kurt Rahn · Post by **Kurt Rahn** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 12:02 am

Has like three times the torque of an S2000

And that torque is driven thru which wheels?

Leonard Cachola · Post by **Leonard Cachola** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 12:56 am

Kurt Rahn wrote:
Has like three times the torque of an S2000
And that torque is driven thru which wheels?

The wrong ones!

Steve Ekstrand · Post by **Steve Ekstrand** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 1:22 am

Okay....

Come on Henry... You know you really want a Cummins Turbo Diesel Ram 3500 Mega Cab. That backseat brings a concert hall feeling to the casting couch.
And what??? 10 times the torque of an S2000. And yes RWD!!!

Bob Beamesderfer · Post by **Bob Beamesderfer** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 8:21 am

Leonard Cachola wrote:
Bob Beamesderfer wrote:
Mako Koiwai wrote:The new Miata's are so softly sprung that they can't be rescued with stiff shocks. Leonard sold his. They have to go straight to CSP so you can get stiffer springs. I did a run with one on Saturday. The paddle shifters were fun to down shift going into corners but sometimes difficult to reach with the wheel cranked over. The car is so sloppy you have to input an incredible amount of time earlier then usual!
I'd check with Brian Goodwin first on this score. Besides, weren't we talking about a daily driver?
It's been long known that the NC just doesn't cut it for autocross in stock form - even Goodwin knows this, hence his highly modified IS2 NC. The only NC that does is the ultra-rare 2007 MS-R version (or one that's been converted). However, with that said, I feel that the retractable hard top version makes a fine daily driver - good ride, decent handling, and the fastest retractable hard top in production.

That triple adjustable Penskes can't remedy the soft springs surprises me a little, but the NC is definitely mushy in comparison to the NB. And, yes, it makes a great daily driver because the top works so well. As for paddle shifters in production cars, on really twisty roads they're worthless. Manufacturers have added them as a gimmick to such slugs as the Mitsubishi Lancer with the god-awful CVT. :mrt:

The Caliber SRT-4 doesn't handle all that well; too heavy, wrong-wheel drive.

Cal Club Autocross Forums

Henry I was wrong

Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong

Re: Henry I was wrong